Grappling Fighter prestige class-anyone know?

[casdegere]

Ok, I did some reading and I discovered a few things...the first was that I have been in error as to my understanding of this discussion topic. My apologies.

Normal: A Grapple attempt (A Grab) normally invokes if opponent is armed, an AOO. If ANY damage is sustained, the Grab fails unconditionally.

Improved Grapple: Takes this AOO away completely.

Also, a Grapple Attempt is considered a Melee Touch Attack. Armor and Shields can not be taken into account for the DC of this unopposed attack.

Close Quarters Fighting: Allows for an Attack of Opportunity each round someone attempts to Grapple him. Only 1 AOO is allowed per round per person attempting to grapple. (Incase of Combat Reflexes) If it hits, the damage from this attack adds to the Grapplers DC to Grab him. (Melee Touch AC+Damage taken) So the incoming Grapple attempt is not automatically thwarted but it gives a better chance to thwart it.

What we were doing is applying an opposed Grapple check to the initial Grab. Making it much more difficult to succeed in the Grab.

Say someone with a magical TWO handed sword 2d6+1 and say 18 strength +6 to two handed damage maxes out...+19 for instance, this is added to the Melee Touch AC. For a fighter it may be typically 11 to 13, so say 11+19=DC of 30. Azcot's Latch to Body grab check is +23. He needs only a 7 or higher to successfully Grab his opponent, making it a bit easier to accomplish then the way we did it before. (I still think there should be a penalty for Large and Reach weapons but I think I can live with this without changing anything)

That said...I discovered that Quick Draw does not allow one to make an AOO. A feat called Snap Draw does, however.

Again, this is my bad as the rules confused me but now it all makes more sense. I think they thought Grabbing someone was far to easy and they wanted to give an experienced Fighter an extra chance to avoid being grabbed.

[Andre]

Thanks for the research casdegere ... But one area I'm a bit confused about.. I was under the impression it goes like this when the close quarters fighting feat is not involved...

- attacking grappler makes a touch attack (in Azcot's case without provoking an attack of opportunity )

- both combatants roll opposed grapple checks the first round someone is grappled and every round thereafter

- each round afterwards opponents go on making opposed grapple checks.

Let me know if this concurs with your findings

[darkalloy]

It sort of goes like that Andre.

-Grappler makes a touch attack, victim gets AoO. (Unless grappler has improved graple and the victim doesn't have CQ.)

-both combatants make grapple checks, if the grappler wins the victim is grappled, if the victim wins the grappler doesn't grapple.

-provided the grappler has won he makes a grapple check opposed by either a grapple check or an escape artist check each round.

-Pinning and other things can be employed while the grapple is maintained.

[casdegere]

No, This is correct Andre, The point I was making was about CQF. It only applies to the Grab portion of the round. Consequently, the portion we were continually messing up.

[casdegere]

I guess that is close.

Touch attack for the Grab. (AOO - Impr. Grapple or CQF AOO provided the opponent is armed) If successful the character is Grabbed.

After this its all about pinning/holding.

An opposed Grapple check as normal. There are no longer opportunities for AOO or the use of CQF at this point.

If successful the character is Pinned/held/Grappled and Unarmed Attack damage could be applied if desired immediately.

After this its round 2 and opposed Grapple checks need to be made as the two Grapple.